Speaker 1 (00:03):
Hey everyone, it’s Devin Burke. Welcome to this first episode of Interviewing Experts that can help you sleep better, show up more, uh, manage your stress. I am interviewing today having a conversation today with Michelle Buk, who’s an amazing person that I had the chance of meeting at the Art of Success Summit with David Nagle a few months ago. And I was really looking forward to this call because Michelle is, not only is she incredible human and dancer, she’s also a Body talk practitioner, and I don’t really know too much about Body Talk. So I was excited to, you know, get Michelle on here to share with us what Body Talk is. Um, you know, what are some of the benefits of Body Talk and how can we use maybe some of the tools or strategies to help us manage our stress so that we could sleep better and we could show up in more peace, power, and presence. So, Michelle, thank you so much for creating the space. I know you’re a busy person with everything that you’re doing to, uh, to have a conversation with me today.
Speaker 2 (01:05):
Thank you, Devin. Yeah, I what a beautiful introduction to, to the purpose of why you’re doing this recording, too. Like I feel like I had to take notes about that
Speaker 1 (01:15):
<laugh>. Well, it’s re it’s gonna be live to for the world to see. So you, you can watch the recording. Um,
Speaker 2 (01:21):
Yeah. Yeah. So I, so I am, yeah. As you said, I’m a dancer, choreographer, teacher, and I also do Life Coach and Energy Life coaching and Energy Medicine and Body Talk is one of those systems. And I just wanna share, like with the audience how we met, which was, we were at the Artist Success Summit, which is amazing, and just like so much information mm-hmm. <affirmative> and I went outside and I took off my sustainably made gold foil, high heels, and stood barefoot on the grass. And you walked by me and you’re like, grounding or something,
Speaker 1 (01:54):
<laugh>,
Speaker 2 (01:56):
He understands what I’m doing here. Um, so it, like, that’s, that’s just, uh, that was our connection. And then like we, we just had a few short conversations that were sort of, because it was almost the end, just like bubbling over with information and passion that we share about supporting our health. And for me, um, as a creative, as an artist, dancer, and a healer, I have really, um, you know, I, I come from, I, I guess I would say a creative lens and looking at health. Mm-hmm. And that the, the meaning of that word is to make something whole.
Speaker 1 (02:37):
I love that.
Speaker 2 (02:38):
I know, I love that too. I use that in my teaching all the time. It’s just how do we bring all parts of yourself to the picture? So even though you introduced me as a Body Talk practitioner, I got certified in 2008, is that right? 2008. Yeah. Um, and it was a, it was a modality that changed my life and I’m happy to talk more about it. Um, I was gonna say here, it’s, it’s like that is one of the tools of many, like, presence included meditation, movement, bio geometry, maybe we’ll talk about that. Yeah. Source P therapy, like you and met all the d like all the somatic things that I’ve studied. All of those things were in service for me initially to dance more. Like I wanted to dance and I got an injury. And it wasn’t about being site specific and looking at that injury, which is something we have been trained in our Western medical system to do.
(03:32)
It’s like you’re, what happened for me literally is my ankle. I sprained my ankle and it was, how can we work on the ankle, but the ankle’s, like the weak link. So it’s, so just, if I can tie this into wholeness, when we look at the whole picture of somebody and everything that’s going on, and we invite all of that in, then we can set up a really unique, uh, container system to help a person just live into that. Hmm. Instead of prescribing, like, take this thing for this thing. And that’s something that Body Talk really taught me.
Speaker 1 (04:07):
That’s beautiful. And I, I love, I love, it’s, it’s always so fascinating and, and it’s, it’s not uncommon that, you know, this type of discovery that led you to study all these amazing things to help people heal and become more whole happen from a place of pain and from, you know, so it’s like, it’s really always so beautiful. And I just wanna kind of just connect to that because it’s like, so many people I think struggle and they just, they get stuck on, you know, the suffering of whatever’s happening, whether it’s physical pain or mental emotional pain or something that’s happening in their life and they sometimes miss out on the beautiful gift that it is, that it could be leading you to like yourself, you know, to kind of open up and explore how can you bring in these other beautiful modalities to create more wholeness in your life? And then obviously that’s gonna inspire you to share that once you, once you have it, cuz it’s like amazing gift that you’ve been given. Um, but I just kind of wanted to just kind of make a comment about that cuz it’s, it’s so interesting, um, the conversations that I have with, with people that are up to big things in the world, healers, creatives, artists, and just the people that are movers and shakers. It’s, it’s really interesting how most of their journey has started out of a place of pain and suffering in some way.
Speaker 2 (05:29):
Right? Yeah. I I talked about this once as, as your body’s course correcting mechanism. Hmm. And that’s, that’s something that I, I started to see in my life, even as a teenager, when I got injured, when I was trying to dance and I was trying to dance in a particular way. I was trying to, to, to dance with, like, fitting myself into this little container. And that led to injury. So my body course corrected me. It’s like, that’s not gonna work. We’re going to, we’re gonna do this thing to your foot, so you can’t dance anymore. <laugh>. You know, and I think the, the ideal thing is we just keep on building our awareness so we don’t have to have these huge emergency course corrections and or we build up our capacity to weather those course corrections because everyone’s gonna have a different, I’m seeing like a boat ride, maybe it’s the water in the back, you know, it’s like <laugh> sometimes it’s really chill and cool, and then otherwise it’s go, other times it’s gonna be tumultuous. Yeah. And we know that now in our world, like depending on how much you pay attention to what’s going on, uh, around, like, it’s tumultuous. And for me it was always like, okay, let me see what’s tumultuous inside of me. <laugh>, you know, this sort of like, I wanna do the work here because I know that’s how I can best show up and, and, and tend to anything else in the world. Yeah. When I tend to like garden of myself first.
Speaker 1 (06:57):
It’s so true. Like the inner environment, when we take care of that, how that literally translates to like our outer environment and it’s like such an easy thing. It’s such an easy thing to forget or disconnect from when we’re, you know, trying to get everything done and we’re trying to, you know, take care of life. And it’s, um, yeah. It’s really, so body talk is, is more, is that, that was one of the tools that you studied and is that something that helps us connect with awareness in our bodies so that we can sort of make those adjustments or tell us a little bit more about, you know, that one toolbox that you have in your Sure. Uh, in your arsenal?
Speaker 2 (07:36):
Yeah, sure. So, um, body Talk, is it really, like, it’s kind of like what the name sounds like. It’s bringing the systems of your body into improved communication. Because when we get stressed out or experienced trauma or injury, all of the, like billions, if you, if not more, probably more, um, communication systems and signals that are happening can start to break down. So when it’s just like in a relationship, if you’re not talking to each other, it doesn’t really support the relationship. So it’s just like, that’s a simple way to just talk about what it does. On a more like, technical level, there is, it’s, there’s a whole protocol that the practitioner follows that serves as a map of the person’s, uh, well I wanna say body, but system because it’s not just your body, it’s your environment, it’s your belief systems. It’s, I mean, it can literally go to what are the planetary influences?
(08:35)
Like how are those aspected in your life right now? Um, there’s even, I’ve studied epigenetics, studied the microbiome through Amazing Body Talk, uh, practitioners and teachers. So it’s, for me, I found it to be one of the most comprehensive maps of how to address a person. And the way a se a session looks traditionally is you have a client in your space, you, they’re lying down on a table and you do muscle testing with a, um, asking what the priority is for healing. And there’s a way to navigate this very, uh, extensive chart of body parts, environment, all the things I just said. So the practitioner, there’s a couple of things. First of all, the practitioner’s asking, it’s not telling, it’s one of, one teacher said to me, this beautiful thing, we sit down with limited wisdom. We always sit down with limited wisdom as the practitioner, and we ask, so it’s based on this, this belief that the body has an innate wisdom that is always governing it or guiding it towards healing.
(09:37)
And I would call that the course correcting mechanism. So we can just use muscle testing. I mean, this, this can sound so woowoo, but it’s amazing <laugh>. We can use muscle testing to find out what the priority is. And, and the reason the priority part is important is because what I referenced before with this Western model is we see the symptom, we see the ankle sprain, we treat the ankle, we see the indigestion, we treat the indigestion. Whereas that’s just, that’s like the weak link in the chain that has shown up because there’s something going on with some unresolved memories from when you were 18 linking to your father, linking to this ligament in your knee. Like <laugh>. It’s, it’s kinda, you know, um, I, so I use it in my coaching now, but not quite as much. I more so use the principles, but I, I definitely use it in my group, my group workshops, um, in person and online.
(10:30)
But it’s, it can get really particular and specific and it’s amazing. And it’s, it, it, as a practitioner, when I had a clinical practice, which I was doing for about 11 years, I was learning so much just by asking, mm. Like, this person know their wisdom knows much more than I could ever know. So let me set that aside. Let me use these structures that I have to, to dialogue with that. So what it looks like, let me just scroll back, is, is the practitioner builds these formulas. Like I said, there’s something going on with unresolved stuff when you’re 18, linking to your dad, linking to your right knee ligament, whichever ligament, you know. And once these formulas get built, the practitioner then just taps over the head brain. So the brain in the head starts to, um, adjust and rebalance and, uh, reharmonize systems, you tap over the heart, brain because the heart brain memorizes and stores the information.
(11:26)
And then you tap over the gut brain because the gut brain deeply integrates and brings in that discernment and decision making to just, you know, like complete the picture. So it, it also, like, it has this, um, I mean this is from Body Mind centering too, another modality I’ve studied where the hierarchy is not up here. And I think, you know, we we’re coming out of an age where this has been the hi the hierarchy. Mm-hmm. And it’s interesting how a lot of us who are doing this work, we’re having to clean up the mental garbage, the mental messes we’ve gotten ourselves into because we haven’t connected to, to body, we haven’t connected to spirit or emotion. So again, like for me, that’s a picture of the wholeness.
Speaker 1 (12:11):
That’s so beautiful. I mean, that’s so powerful. And I think it’s so timely right now because it’s so true. There’s so much of this going on all the time that people are disconnected from this and from their gut Right. And from, from their body. Right. Essentially. Yeah. And it sounds like, um, you know, body Talk is really an amazing system of identifying, kind of drawing connections to the, the system of what, not just what broke down, but why it broke down. Yeah. And what do we need to clean up from here to here to our, from here and wherever else we need to a balance or, or brick shine a a light to Yes. To really find harmony in the body. Is is that pretty much what you’re saying?
Speaker 2 (12:56):
Yeah. Yeah. I mean, the thing that’s beautiful with Body Talk too is like the precision because, because the way the system is set up, the precision I can get as a practitioner to the details that are necessary. And I think, like even if I don’t use Body Talk per se in my sessions now, I, there’s an ability to pinpoint like what this is. And, and it’s, it’s not diagnostic. Um, but gosh, I’m going, my mind is going in a couple different directions here. There’s a, there’s it. Yeah. It’s, it’s okay. How can we bring in all of you? And I, I think as a dancer too, I, I, I would learn that, you know, it’s like, okay, this thing hurts here. I’m not gonna focus on the thing that hurts, but let’s bring in the rest of the picture to support this. It’s like the community of yourself. <laugh>
Speaker 1 (13:49):
Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. I love that.
Speaker 2 (13:50):
You know. Um, so yeah. It’s, it’s, uh, it, it taught me that we are more than just a conglomeration of parts that we are consciousness organizing the parts. So body talk, it, it taught me how to work with consciousness. It taught me a, a along with bio geometry, how
Speaker 1 (14:09):
To which we definitely gotta talk about
Speaker 2 (14:11):
<laugh>. It taught me how to work with quality. Like what is the frequency, or what is the vibration I’m in? Because fear has a very different vibration than trust. And, and for me, also, there’s, I say this a lot in my teaching, and especially with movement, there’s, there’s no right or wrong way to do something. It’s just what is it making possible? And if it’s not making possible the thing that you desire, cool. Let’s get curious and see how we can adjust this so it supports what you desire.
Speaker 1 (14:43):
Wow. That’s so powerful. I love that. I mean, the, it’s, you know, it’s those curiosity po in creating possibility is, you know, if you can do that for yourself and for other people, how valuable of, of a, of, you know, that’s, that’s what we all need more of. Right.
Speaker 2 (15:03):
Do. And it’s for me, like it moves me to even to even talk about it, it, it, like, is one of the f my my most favorite things. I can see <laugh> or like, when I witness, it’s like I’m tearing up a little bit when I witness someone, like coming into their potential or like, you know, I’m not, I’m not a mom, but I’ve spent time around kids for sure. And babies. And it’s just like that discovery and that place where, okay, I have options here. And I, for me, it’s like, I, it’s like the flower keeps growing. You know? It’s like we’re giving it space to do exactly what it needs to do. And, and if we can do that for ourselves and for other people, like, oh my God, that’s, that’s, I, it’s, I love it.
Speaker 1 (15:45):
<laugh>. Yeah. Well, we need more of that. I mean, it’s, it, the word that I would use is creating hope. Mm-hmm. <affirmative> hope, creating light where there’s maybe darkness, creating possibility where there’s perceived impossibility. Creating a space to, to fill with, with curiosity and, and be open to seeing what that brings into your life, whether it’s with your health or a relationship or, uh, with your business. I mean, that’s, I we absolutely need more of that, like now. Right. Yeah. And it sounds like you, you studied a lot of different, you know, modalities, not just body talk that you have whole toolbox of, of other amazing, um, I guess we could call ’em modalities, is that what the word that you would use modalities? Yeah. And to, to really help people create, to create and get connected to possibility in their life and in their bodies. And to create, uh, a space for them to be curious to, uh, to what might be going on that is keeping them back from this limitless potential that we all have inside of us that somehow we forget about.
Speaker 2 (16:57):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (16:57):
Right. And so why don’t we share, I mean, I, I know we, we could talk for, for hours, but I know you have so much wisdom and you, you studied a lot of different things. Um, so let’s kind of shift gears a little bit and talk a little bit about, uh, bio geometry, because that was really fascinating to me. And you were wearing this beautiful ch uh, necklace, this like charm on your, on your neck. And I, and I remember that was one of the conversations we had. I was like, wow, what is that? And you, yeah. Oh, it’s bio geometry. And I was like, what’s that? And then you started to explain it to me and, and, um, and I went off and, and started to read about it. And then I ended up actually purchasing some, uh, the same, the same, uh, pen. Yeah. And, uh, so yeah. So why don’t we, why don’t you share a little bit about that and kinda how that plays into
Speaker 2 (17:46):
Sure. So, so I, um, I kind of like this thread. I’m sure it’ll feed in here around desire, um, as a, as a sort of like leading point for how to li to go through our lives. This, I, I encountered bio geometry because I, I was making a dance. I was choreographing a piece, uh, that was going to be shown in New York. And I wanted to, uh, research sacred geometry. And some of my friends who are body talk practitioners were like, no, no, no, no, no, you gotta, you gotta look at bio geometry. So I was like, okay, <laugh>. And I actually applied for a grant to go to Gozo in Malta in the Mediterranean to study with a teacher named Chris Ard. And he was a Body Talk, uh, teacher of many different, um, courses in, in the Body Talk system. And now he was working with Bio Geometry, and I didn’t really know what I was getting into entirely, but it was another, it was another paradigm shifter.
(18:47)
Oh, here’s what, here’s one thing that was beautiful before I went to, uh, Gozo to study with him. He was in New York, and we were taking a walk, and he, he said this beautiful thing about bio geometry, which is that you can harmonize, what were we talking about? I’ll just say it’s like, uh, let’s say someone has, uh, a lay line or something, or you know, like a, I don’t wanna get too technical here, but like, uh, a less than positive <laugh> or like a, a more, uh, harmful energy passing through their bedroom, like on their, like along their bed or something since we’re, we’re in the sleep realm. Uh, yeah, I like that. And, and instead of like putting up protection to, you know, which, which are some approaches are to protect, or like sort of armor, bio geometry uses shape and number to transmute energy.
(19:41)
So nothing gets, nothing gets quote unquote thrown away. And that was always a thing for me when I would look at our garbage system. I was like, wait, we’re just putting stuff in a landfill hoping that it’s like it’s hidden over there, or we put people in prison and they’re hi. Like, right. You know what I mean? So instead it integrates everything. And I thought that was so beautiful that no, we don’t need to get rid of their, their famous case study is I, which I told you about, um, at Art of Success was the cell tower that got put on top of the church sequel. Hmm. And when that happened in this town in Switzerland, the animals started getting sick. People started getting sick, because churches are usually, they’re power spots in the earth. And, and we have, like, these exist, like the US Capitol is built on one, the, like, just usually the, there’s power lines that go through the, the architectural layout of Paris, and they’re amplified by the, you know, the archways and whatnot in Japan, like the entrances to the temples.
(20:41)
There’s a reason for that architecture. Mm. It enhances and enables energy to move in a certain way. So, gosh, where am I going with all this? Um, so what I learned in bio geometry is that all of these frequencies exist. And I didn’t get too technical about it. Like, I, I have tools where you can measure, you know, like all electronics actually emit a harmful energy, but you can transmute those with shape. You can get a little sticker from, uh, their website that you put on your router or you, you know, you put on your appliances in your home. Um, so it’s really just about creating an environment that’s supportive. And one thing that Dr. Kareem says is that harmony begets harmony. So the more you start to do that, and Body Talk does the same thing, it brings things into harmony. The more you start to do that, the more that it, it just, it draws that in. And in fact, Chris, my teacher, he <laugh> has this great story where he was in his car and he ha he had just picked up a huge shipment of all of these tools, like these cues, the pendants, it’s all the different things. And he was getting gas, and the, the guy in the gas station’s like, Hey, you want a cup of coffee? Like, he walks out and he gives him coffee, and everyone just kinda like, started coming up to him and
Speaker 1 (21:56):
Talking to him,
Speaker 2 (21:57):
And he’s like, what’s going on here? Why is everyone being so nice to me? <laugh> like, later he got home, he’s like, he’s unloading his car. He put it together. He’s like, oh my God, everyone, you know, it’s like we get drawn to the thing that that is life.
Speaker 1 (22:11):
Yes. It’s, it’s, it’s, so, it’s, it’s, uh, you know, so for some people they might think, oh, this is like woowoo stuff. Yeah. Right. Or like, this is like some magical mystical, but if you think about it, I mean, all we are really is vibrating particles. All we are really is frequency and energy at it, even at a like, quantum level. Right. So it’s, you know, it’s, it makes perfect sense. Yeah. When, you know, you’re, you’re finding the balance and you’re bringing harmony into an environment, uh, using shapes or symbols or, you know, some sort of, um, uh, you know, tool Yeah. To, to find that, that’s, why wouldn’t that make an impact on your energy? Why wouldn’t that make an impact on your, you know, your, your ability to, to find harmony? And I think it’s awesome to, to really be able to talk and share and have tools and even a system that enables people to, to find that balance Yeah.
(23:10)
In their homes or in their bodies. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, I mean, it’s all like, it’s just we have, we have access to all this incredible information, and it’s really a matter of being open to it. Yeah. And then trying it and experimenting it and, and, and being open to experimenting. Right? Yeah. Yeah. Um, because I think a lot of people sometimes get shut down to, oh, this is woo right. And this is, but at the end of the day, it’s like, it’s not. And that’s what’s so cool today is all this science is, is backing up mm-hmm. <affirmative> all the woo. Right. And, and it’s like, not that we needed the science too, but now today we, we understand, uh, quantum energy and understand frequency and we under, so it’s just, I always get really excited, um, to talk about this stuff because I think there needs to be more awareness about it. And, and really there needs to be more awareness about people that are providing services and tools and, and things to help us create more harmony. I mean, at, at the end of the day, I think that’s what we’re, we’re all looking for, right? We’re all looking for that peace.
Speaker 2 (24:16):
Yeah. I mean, we desire to connect or to be, to be reminded that we are connected. You know, we were talking about this just a bit ago. It’s like, yeah, I think maybe even David said this, like our, one of our number one fears is of abandonment. Yep.
(24:32)
And it’s like, it’s <laugh>. This is, we’re talking about the energetic, sort of the, the technical aspects of connection, but it’s, uh, it’s so much more than that too. You know? And I think it’s also if, if looking at this theme of wholeness to bring in the, the emotional connections we have with people, the spiritual connections, the energetic connections, like energy being the science of it, but depending on what, which venue <laugh> you want or which avenue you wanna take as you look, I mean, what you’re saying too, it’s just like, just get curious. Yeah. Like, is your life what you want it to be right now? And if it’s not the solution exists, are you willing to open your eyes to a solution that maybe you would’ve never considered?
Speaker 1 (25:20):
Love that. That’s a powerful question. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, that is a powerful question. And, and hopefully everyone that’s gonna be watching this actually can really let that settle in and, and let that land. Because I think that’s a question that we all need to ask ourselves every day, because we all get stuck in certain ways, no matter how much work you’re doing, I don’t care how many energy healers or shock recessions or, you know, whatever you’re doing Right. Define the harmony. Yeah. Um, I think that’s a really powerful question to, to reflect on. You know, are you willing, you know, that’s that, and, and, you know, that’s, it’s powerful. That’s a powerful phrase. Yeah. And that really, just that question alone can open up possibility.
Speaker 2 (26:05):
Sure. And it’s totally, it, it also hands the power over to the person. Hmm. So we can be reminded that, okay, I do have a choice in this, and if I’m not willing, or if you’re not willing, like, okay, what, what can we do to support you in that? Why is it that you’re resisting?
Speaker 1 (26:23):
Hmm.
Speaker 2 (26:24):
You know, because sometimes we, we resist because we think it’s what’s keeping us safe. Are you willing to let go of the resistance? And that’s a scary place because then we go into unknown territory.
Speaker 1 (26:37):
Right.
Speaker 2 (26:38):
But that’s a muscle we can build too, to like, keep opening that resistance. It’s like, okay, this is maybe not so scary. Or, I remember I was doing a group session like, like, when was it? Sun, sun two Sundays ago. And there was a woman we, with this metaphor came in of like, um, I don’t know how we got there, but just like, she’s on the swing. And so the whole group, this was on Zoom, so it’s just like, you could see the people just like, okay, we’re on the swing and you, all you have to do is jump. You know? And it was super, super fun. And then she just jumped and she’s, and we were like, how was it? And she’s like, wow. It was so much easier than I thought.
Speaker 1 (27:13):
Wow. What a great, powerful metaphor.
Speaker 2 (27:16):
Oh, it was so fun. It just, like, it just came out. But I mean, I, I do like play a lot, so that comes in, but I think that it’s like the fear is often bigger than the actual step that needs to be taken.
Speaker 1 (27:27):
Yeah. Yeah. And that’s where all the good stuff is. Right? That’s where all the, the breakthroughs happen. That’s where all the, the gifts are. Yeah. And it’s just, you know, having the willingness to let go Yeah. And to trust and to be in that space of surrender and, and be in that space of curiosity and be in that space of possibility, that really does end up healing. Totally. Whatever needs to be healed. Cause I mean, I believe that our bodies, and I’m sure you, I’m not gonna put words in your mouth, but based off this conversation, that we can heal whatever we want to heal, whether it’s insomnia, whether it’s a physical condition. Um, our bodies are so intelligent. Yeah. It’s like we are able to tap into what our bodies truly need Yeah. And create the environments to, to, to support that.
Speaker 2 (28:17):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (28:18):
It’s like, you know, mi miracles happen.
Speaker 2 (28:21):
Yeah, totally. Yeah. That word miracles. There’s this artist, um, she’s no longer living, but she’s name, her name is Emma Koons, and I was fortunate enough to visit her center in, outside of Zurich in Switzerland. And, um, there’s a, there’s an essay. I think the guy who founded the center, who was healed by her or aided, like, ushered into healing. He had polio, and his dad was convinced there was a solution for him. And this was, I think maybe late 18 hundreds, might be getting the dates wrong. Um, and he, her, his dad found Emma Koons. He was like, I know there’s a solution. He found this person. She used a pendulum, which gives another thing that could be woowoo, but it’s, it’s all it’s energy. Right. Um, and it’s asking, it’s being, it’s being in conversation with this sentient wisdom that’s everywhere. So she realized, she found out with her pendulum that there was a stone near where he grew up that, um, would heal the polio. So they, they went there, they, they made a poulis out of this stone or mineral, which now you can buy there and you can go to the grotto. It’s amazing. Um, and they put it on his legs for three months, and his, his polio was cured.
Speaker 1 (29:34):
Wow.
Speaker 2 (29:35):
So it’s, and, and, but the reason I bring her up is because in this article, um, he, I’m not remembering his name right now, talks about how she says, there’s, there’s no miracles. I’m just following the laws of the universe, which is like a wonderful thing that David talks about. Or even like this occupational therapist who works with brain injured kids. Oh my God, so many tangents. I I, his, um, he runs the Family Hope Center outside of Philadelphia, and he has one of the highest success rates for dealing with brain injured children. So autism, B blindness, deafness, 80 A D H D. And he would talk about, it’s like the body responds. It just, it’s, it is, there’s no mystery. You know, if the ch, if the child’s eyes aren’t like, you know, there’s many levels like nutrition and body talk and energy work and, and training the parent to be the practitioner because the environment needs to support the child, not just someone over here. So like, you become, you become the, you become your practitioner, your parent, you know, or for the child, you, you create that environment for your child. But it’s, it’s, it’s, it’s just how things operate.
Speaker 1 (30:46):
<laugh>. Yeah. And it’s, and it’s, it’s us that we try to, we, it’s again, we get stuck up here and tell ourselves a story that keeps us from allowing the natural flow of energy and healing to take place. Yeah. And it’s, um, so why don’t we talk a little bit about like, kind of some practical tools, tips, things. I mean, you have a lot of wisdom, you have a lot of tools. Uh, you’ve been doing what you’ve been doing for a really long time. Um, you know, what, what are some of the maybe simple things that would help people that maybe are disconnected from that harmony or disconnected from that possibility to bring some harmony back to, to, you know, move the stress, get out of their head, get back into their bodies, um, so that they can, you know, get better sleep Yeah. And wake up with more peace, power, and presence. Like, what are some, some things that would be really helpful that people maybe are just aren’t aware of that they could do themselves or, you know, facilitate with somebody else to, to have that shift happen for them?
Speaker 2 (31:51):
Okay. Yeah, great question. I, and I also wanna hear your answer to that too. Um, or maybe I sh I know you have a ton of tools too, and I would just love to hear a couple of them.
Speaker 1 (32:00):
Oh, yeah. We, I mean, we, we could talk for, for days about this, so, yeah, I know, and I know it’s a tough question because of all the tools that there’s so much, right? Yeah.
Speaker 2 (32:08):
Um, well, I think one of, like, one of the first things is that like, I think people can get overwhelmed with how much there is. Yeah. But just like, find a simple thing that works and, and, and, and do it. Actually do it. Because sometimes, sometimes that’s the hardest thing is like, we know what something needs. We know it doesn’t help to be on the phone right before you go to bed. Right? Right. So get an alarm clock that so you don’t need your phone in your bedroom and keep it in another room. Like, that’s been my success has been to not look at it before I go to bed when I wake up. Because even that wake up time, it like, like I’m, I, I’m sure you’ve stu I imagine you’ve studied this mm-hmm. <affirmative>, we need that transition. So anyway, so I’ll let, I’ll let you take that one. But, so one thing that I can share really readily, which you can find on my website, embody radiance.com, m body radiance.com, if you go to my blog, there’s a, a post called a Super Tool for Reducing Stress. And it’s, it’s the courtesy technique, which is, you can also just look up Michelle Bule courtesy and the video might pop up. Um, it’s a, it’s a system or a, a, a really simple technique. It takes like a minute or two, and I won’t go through it here because I think it’s better to just look, I don’t,
Speaker 1 (33:25):
Yeah. People can go and, and, and, and download or, or see, find the video and maybe explain a little bit about what, what it, what it is or what it can do. Sure.
Speaker 2 (33:34):
One of the major things is, it does, is it resets your, uh, sympathetic nervous system mm-hmm. <affirmative>. So it gets you to calm down. It, it gets you to be in that place of digestion and rest. And I always like to say creativity and actually, like when we’re sleeping too, it’s, it, it is creation. We are rebuilding ourselves. So this is a great one. Just like our, our nervous systems can actually get hijacked. That I think everything is, is a stressor. Yeah. So it, it helps, like if you do this cumulatively for 30 days or something, it can help really reset your stress capacity. Because I think we may have talked about this too, at, at the art of success, stress is actually a good thing sometimes. Yeah. It can sharpen us, you know mm-hmm. <affirmative>, but it’s, yeah. It’s letting it be functional. So courtesies is great.
(34:20)
Um, movement, of course, I’m a big proponent of that and movement in terms of exercise, but I’m gonna say also on a consciousness level or an energetic and emotional level, I, and I practice this a lot, this a lot cuz it happens to me all the time. Like, I might feel something and it gets stuck, and I just ask myself, okay, how does this wanna move? And not in my head, but just like, let my body do its thing. So we have been conditioned to hold a certain kind of posture to show up in the world in a certain way. And sometimes our bodies just wanna go back to the five year old that’s like, ah, just before our call. Right. Like, we need that medicine. We
Speaker 1 (35:05):
Need that. That’s so good.
Speaker 2 (35:06):
Yeah. We need that expression. So, so movement, not just the gym or, you know, but like, how does your life energy want to move right now? I love it. And it can look ugly and it can be quote unquote weird, but that is your life. Like, I, I worked with a client the other day and she, she was so, it was amazing. She went there and this we’re doing it on Zoom online like this, and she was like, was that weird? I was like, no, <laugh>. That’s, that is incredible. It’s, it’s incredible. So that would be my second one. And I just say, oh, I kind of have two more
Speaker 1 (35:39):
Diet. Go for it. I’ll give, I’ll give you two. Go for it.
Speaker 2 (35:42):
<laugh>. Wait, diet is another good one. Because yeah, I mean, dieting, just, just all the sort of products that we buy, because anything like cleaning chemicals, body things that we use, what they’re doing is they’re just taxing our systems a little bit more. Yeah. So if we can reduce that, then it’s like our body’s not fighting off this like, foreign antiseptic thing that we just introduced that’s killing our microbiome off and not, it’s like setting off the harmony of our microbiome.
Speaker 1 (36:12):
You know what I got, I gotta just share this because we’re, we’re talking about the water and the fish tank. What I saw, what you just said is a vision of like, muddy water and like all this like dirt in the water that’s creating sort of this confusion and this, and then taking all these, these, these products and foods out to let that just settle back down.
Speaker 2 (36:33):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (36:34):
Like, that was kind of like a, I just had like this little flash when you were talking and I just, I wanted to share it, but that’s, that’s, I love that. Yeah. That’s powerful. I mean, it’s,
Speaker 2 (36:43):
And, and like, it’s simple. It’s really simple, but why not, like, remove those stressors. And I know like, well, you can look at Dr. Bruce Lifton’s talking about like, these are belief systems too. You know, I, I acknowledge that. Um, but right now that’s, he, he says this so beautifully when he is talking about people who, the, in the, I think it’s like Southern Baptist Church, they can get bitten by the poisonous snake and they don’t die, or they drink, they drink stricken. Is that the, that
Speaker 1 (37:09):
Something I, I, I, I, I don’t know what it they’re drinking, but, but yeah, it’s not, they shouldn’t be drinking it.
Speaker 2 (37:13):
<laugh> shouldn’t be drinking it. He says they can drink and they don’t die. And he says in this, in this talk, he’s like, but I won’t drink it because my belief systems aren’t that strong. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, like, he believes that that’s totally true, but for him personally, it would kill him. Like he’s, it’s not like the unapologetic, unwavering a hundred percent belief system. So just wanna put that in there too. Yeah. And then the last thing I would say is just journaling. And that feels like another form of movement for me. Like just putting pen to paper and letting the thoughts run and letting, like, it’s such a great way to purge all the stuff that can keep us from being able to, as you said, settle.
Speaker 1 (37:50):
That’s so awesome. I love it. And that’s such a great strategy and tool just to, I think the Buddhist say, I just learned this over the last three days. Uh, one of the speakers was talking about this Buddhist practice. Yeah. And it’s, um, name it to tame it.
Speaker 2 (38:04):
Oh, cool.
Speaker 1 (38:05):
Which I love. I mean, it’s so simple, but it’s like, yeah, just get it outta your head and get it, like some, some kind of magic happens when you get what’s in here just on the paper, and like you can kind of see it for what it is. And, and it just kind of move. Again, we’re talking about energy movement. It’s like moving through. And that’s such a great practice. Um, and, you know, it’s, it’s, it’s great because, you know, there’s so many tools, there’s so many things that we could do. And I love that you, you know, you, you started out with the preface of just doing something and doing something different. So if you are in a state of stress, if you are in, you know, uh, a state of, you know, sympathetic, you know, fight or flight, like find something to consistently do, whether it’s, you know, Michelle’s balancing your quarter courtes or journaling or moving or, you know, taking out the toxin.
(39:01)
Yeah. It’s like, just find something <laugh>, do it and do it consistently. And then, and then, you know, decide whether or not it’s something you want to continue to do. Like life’s an experiment. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, right? Yeah. And I always, I, I always tell, uh, my clients and, and, and in my programs, I’m like, guys, view this as an experiment. If you come in to this as an experiment, I promise we’re gonna find the solution. Yes. Through, through trying all, you know, the different things that’s gonna work. And, um, so it’s, uh, it’s, yeah, it’s these simple things that are so powerful and important. And I think part of what gets pe in people’s way, and I’m gonna ask, ask you what you think too, is like, it’s just creating this space and, you know, practicing self-care, making yourself, uh, important and, and, and creating this space to do this stuff. I mean, it’s not complicated stuff, right? Yeah. But I think like so many people tell themselves the story that, you know, I’m too busy or, you know, I, I need to take care of this. And then they just never get around to doing the things that could really shift and like allow themselves to have this massive breakthrough.
Speaker 2 (40:19):
Yeah.
Speaker 1 (40:19):
What do you think gets some people’s way from
Speaker 2 (40:22):
I would, I, I think space, space is scary. Yeah. Because then we actually see ourselves
Speaker 1 (40:28):
Hmm.
Speaker 2 (40:29):
You know, and it’s like we, um, we live in a culture of distraction and it’s, it’s quite disempowering. There’s great information out there, but I think it needs to be balanced with, with space. And I, I can even speak to, like, I’ve had to realize like, my to-do list is not letting me achieve what I want to achieve. <laugh>, it’s getting in the way. I, I could see like, there’s a part of it that was like, I’m just distracting myself. So I, I just wanna acknowledge for people like, like, yes. Like totally. You have to just do it. You have to commit, but also it’s gonna be scary.
Speaker 1 (41:09):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (41:10):
You know, and any, any, um, shift we have in our behavior, in our lifestyle, it’s butting up against our subconscious mind that is saying, uh, you’re alive today. I’m doing a great job. Nothing else gets in here. This is, this is how it works. This is the program. So then when we try to do something different, like take space for ourselves, like, like David talks about this circumstance comes in, like, you know, oh wait, but now my child is throwing up in the bathroom. It’s, you know, it’s just like, it’s the test and it’s like the, it’s the, the compass like commitment to the, this, like, the thing I desire. If you really want more space, more time in your life, there’s a, there’s a commitment. And then, and then to be able to deal with whatever comes up around that. But I, I know it’s, it’s like, it’s so beautiful that place of spaciousness. And I think probably you and I know this as people who are serving other people, we’re doing it for ourselves too. I mean, oh my God, when I get to be with people, when there’s space is created, it’s what a gift
Speaker 1 (42:18):
It is. It is. And, and that’s, that’s the greatest gift that you could possibly experience is, is facilitating that. Yeah. And being a part of that for someone else is like, I mean, I think if you ask any healer, coach anyone doing any type of service work, it’s like that is why you do the work. Right. To see that be created and to have some part in facilitating it or creating the space to allow that to even take place. Right. So, amazing. Yeah. So I,
Speaker 2 (42:51):
Can I ask, can I just wanna hear like, what are some of your, like if you were to quickly name a couple of your favorite sleep support pools?
Speaker 1 (43:00):
Yeah. Oh my God, there’s so many. There’s so many
Speaker 2 (43:02):
Perfect ones.
Speaker 1 (43:03):
Um, yeah. So one of the big, the big ones that I’m recently really, it was a real, actually revelation fairly recently, is the connection to purpose. Yeah. And how being disconnected from purpose can actually show up as, you know, sleep in your sleep because you’re, you’re just, you’re not feeling fulfilled. And when you’re not feeling fulfilled and you’re disconnected from that purpose, it’s gonna, it’s creating stress in your body. And, you know, I don’t care what you do if you’re doing all this stuff, but you’re still kind of have that disconnection. It’s like that’s kind of the below the surface thing that sometimes people are trying to address with all this sort of other stuff. And it’s like, well, let’s maybe start there. Like, let’s see. Like, you know, let’s see. You know, do you feel like you’re living in your purpose? Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And, um, so, so that’s one big one.
(43:54)
It’s like asking yourself and really getting connected with, you know, am I in my purpose? Or what can I do to move towards my purpose so maybe I don’t have to healthily manage the, the, the disconnection that’s creating all this, uh, sort of static energy that’s keeping me up. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Um, so that’s one another thing is, you know, as soon as we wake up, that’s one of great night’s sleep is, you know, as soon as we wake up, that’s when a great night’s sleep is being created. Mm-hmm. So what you do throughout your entire day affects whether or not you’re gonna be able to, at the end of the day, allow your body mind to, you know, surrender to the bed. Yes. So, you know, having, taking breaks, you know, because when you’re focused on something, and I work with a lot of high performers, a lot of, um, very successful business people, and no surprise, they have trouble with their sleep <laugh>.
(44:46)
And they’re so focused and that focused energy is allowing them to accomplish and create things. And it’s amazing, but it’s also that focused energy is a constriction of energy and not, they’re not allowing themselves to then expand throughout the day. So at the end of the night when they’re like, okay, I wanna just let up the pressure valve guys, it’s like the container is so packed tight that, you know, you’re not able to release that, um, have that process happen quick enough to then put your body in a, in a, in a state of rest and relaxation. So taking breaks in between, um, like before this call, I was dancing, jumping up and on, up and down on the couch with my nephew and my brother mm-hmm. <affirmative> just to take a, a break right in between the last call that I had. So it doesn’t have to be that, but something creating space in between your day very intentionally, very consciously, and creating the boundary around that space and holding it as a, even if you have to show up a little bit late, right? Yeah. Um, you know, cuz you’re gonna show up that much more powerful and you’re gonna show up that much more present for whoever you’re showing up for. So that would be another, another, uh, strategy or tool. Yeah. I mean obviously Go ahead.
Speaker 2 (46:02):
Oh, I was just gonna say, what’s beautiful about that is, is also, it’s kind of like this thing I was talking about with the body talk perspective is we’re not even gonna look at sleep. Sleep is not the problem. Right. It’s if, if we take the microscope out, oh, you know, let’s look at your purpose. And actually this, this literally just happened this afternoon when I was doing a group call, a woman was saying, she’s like, I don’t know why I procrastinate, like going to bed. Mm-hmm. And she’s like, I think in part it’s cuz I haven’t been satisfied with my day, but I don’t really know, you know, so it’s like exactly what you’re talking about.
Speaker 1 (46:33):
Yeah. Well, thank you for bringing that up. Yeah. I think it’s, it’s, uh, it’s so true. It’s often places like, you know, sleep, having insomnia or having sleep challenges is the symptom. Right. And just like how you were talking with your ankle and how, you know, you don’t just fo you don’t just focus on the ankle to heal, you focus on the system to heal it. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>, that’s the same exact approach I take when it comes to sleep. Like sleep is just not being able to sleep or having insomnia is just the symptom that something in your life or in your body is out of balance. Yeah. And so I think taking that holistic approach and looking at, well, let’s find what’s out of balance. Let’s bring it back into balance so that you can get the sleep that’s gonna heal your body, enable you to show up with peace, power, presence to live life because that’s why you sleep mm-hmm.
(47:20)
<affirmative>. So you can, you can show up and live your life mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Um, and so, so yeah. So I think that, you know, some more very practical tactical things is like, you nailed it on the head with, with technology. I think people, people think this is the question I get all the time, Devin, how do I shut off my mind so that I can go to sleep? Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. And, and I always like to use the example if they have kids of like, what do you do to prepare an infant to go to bed? You read ’em a story, take a hot bath, you, you know, you’re playing with them fresh clothes. And then I’m like, are you doing any of that for yourself? No. They think the I’m gonna get in bed and it’s like, gonna be like a light switch, it’s gonna shut my mind off. It’s like, that’s not how it works. Yeah. So allowing yourself to have like a, a wind down routine, allowing yourself to, to do things that prepare your body for rest and relaxation is so critical. So having like that bedtime ritual of, um, you know, it doesn’t have to be taken a bath. It can be stretching, it can be taking a walk, it can be breathing, it can be, you know, making love to your partner mm-hmm. <affirmative>, um, you know, whatever’s gonna get you to get into your body and get outta your mind Mm.
(48:37)
Mm-hmm. <affirmative> is gonna help. And so, you know, those, those are just some of the, the, the things that I, I share with people, uh, in my programs and coaching that have, um, been very powerful for people.
Speaker 2 (48:50):
Beautiful.
Speaker 1 (48:51):
Yeah. Yeah. Well listen, Michelle, we could, uh, I mean we could talk literally for another three hours. Yeah. <laugh> without a doubt. Um, and, and, and I would at some point we will definitely circle back and have another, another conversation about some of the other things that you’re, uh, you’re doing, uh, some of the other tools that you have in your toolbox. Um, but I wanna be respectful of your time and, and also mine. So, um, is there any lasts? Uh, well first off, where, where can people find you?
Speaker 2 (49:21):
If you go to michelle bule.com? Um, it’s m i c h e l l e. Bule is B o u l e.com. You’ll see that there’s a, there’s a way to look at my dance work or my coaching and healing work. So just if you go to that main page, it’s easiest by my name. You can go to either of those locations to see what I’m up to. Awesome. Um, yeah.
Speaker 1 (49:43):
And is there any, any last, you know, uh, what would you tell people that are looking to release stress and, and sleep better so that they can be connected to more peace, power, and presence? Is there any last sort of, hey, this is, this is like, this is some time of wisdom that maybe someone could open up a possibility for, for somebody that’s looking for that, what would you, what would you tell them?
Speaker 2 (50:10):
Well, I, I don’t, there’s, I have no formula for this, but like, I mean, the things I’ve said, but what’s kind of coming through for me, maybe because it’s a personal practice right now is to allow for fun in your life.
Speaker 1 (50:20):
Awesome.
Speaker 2 (50:21):
<laugh>. Yeah. Like, I, I I I’m working on it more because I know, I know and I know creativity and sometimes it’s like, you know, we become adults and we can, like, we take that out. But the fun is such a beautiful release and a space for creativity and, and we need that sort of, like, I’m thinking of your high performance clients too. It’s like, like, where’s the, the pleasure inside of this?
Speaker 1 (50:45):
Yeah.
Speaker 2 (50:46):
Wow. And like, so yeah, so Summit even I, I was working on this last week with my coach, like, how can we make this fun? How can I make, like, it’s not like when you’re, when you’re taking your kid to bed, okay, we got it. We gotta get serious. Now do, there’s, there’s like pleasure, there’s laugh or there’s a story. There’s like the animals, you know, and yeah. So yeah. So fun. That’s
Speaker 1 (51:07):
Just, so let me, that’s, that’s, I’m so happy that I asked the question and that was your answer. And let me ask you, so what are you doing in your life right now to bring in more of that fun?
Speaker 2 (51:18):
Well, literally, I just moved out of New York City a week ago and I have no home right now. Um, so I am sleeping. I, I just, I realized this, I’m gonna be in nine different cities in three countries in the next two months. Wow. Which is
Speaker 1 (51:29):
A little,
Speaker 2 (51:30):
It’s kind of how my life has been running, but I know, and time zone. So I definitely have like, sleep strategies for that too. Mm-hmm. <affirmative>. Um, but I, I have been setting up my life so I can have more space. Cool. Like that space that I don’t know what’s gonna happen. And I just listen to that compass like, wait, is this fun anymore? Why did this, like, okay, I can feel it in my body. All right, fun, fun would let me do this. Shake up the energy. Like how does it wanna move? Like, get into that, that, I’m just gonna call it the kid body, but like, the permission of the child to like, it, it, like, usually it leads to laughter. I feel like, you know, you, I see that in my nieces and nephews sometimes. It’s like they’re suppressing the smile, you know, it’s like, wait, right. Fun right here. So just like, if you could, that’s a pressure ve for me too. Like really open that up, laugh, smile, tell a joke.
Speaker 1 (52:21):
Yeah. We could all use a little bit more fun, I think. Yeah. I mean, I know I could and I’m, I’m, I’m definitely, that’s, that’s definitely an intention for me. Um, yeah, this year. And I think hopefully it is for people that are listening to this as well, because when you’re having fun, you’re light. When you’re having fun, you’re bright and, um, I don’t know what else. Rhymes. Rhymes with bright <laugh>. You’re not in a fight. Right?
Speaker 2 (52:44):
<laugh>,
Speaker 1 (52:44):
What’d you think? I said, you’re not in a fight.
Speaker 2 (52:46):
Not in a fight. You got it right. You
Speaker 1 (52:47):
Got it right. There we go. That’s the icing on the cake. Well Michelle, I wanna just thank you so much for I know how busy you are with your clients and your dancing and all the things that you’re doing. So I wanna, you know, thank you for creating the space to add some value and share your knowledge and wisdom with us. And I look forward to, um, to, uh, connecting with you more and, um, and hopefully having some fun at some point together. Who knows, uh, wherever you are in the world and um, or maybe at another seminar or something. So it was so, so awesome connecting with you and, um, keep, keep inspiring and keep doing the work that you’re doing, cuz we definitely need more of that in the world.
Speaker 2 (53:23):
Awesome. Yeah. Thank you Devin. Likewise, total honor to be here and thank you for doing what you’re doing. Awesome.
Speaker 1 (53:29):
My, my pleasure. All right. I’m just gonna end this.